Interesting Grafting Articles

[aclum]

Hi all,

I've been sort of scarce around here for a while due to some family health issues , tomato burnout after huge early season harvests that I could barely keep up with , and frustration in dealing with the drought later on in the season.

I have been checking in to read the posts here most everyday, though, and reading everyone's grow lists for the upcoming season has snapped me out of my tomato doldrums .

I'm planning on grafting again using RST-04-106-T this year (used 105 last year). To finally get to my point , I came across one really good article that I found very helpful in planning my grafting timing:

https://ag.purdue.edu/hla/fruitveg/M..._Hu_Tomato.pdf

Based on the rootstock I'm using, I'm starting seeds for the scions and rootstock at the same time.

Also of interest are several of the links that can be found here:

http://www.vegetablegrafting.org/res...ing-symposium/

Enjoy! (and excuse all the silly emoticons - I haven't posted for so long, I had to get it out of my system)

Anne

[Worth1]

Hi Anne waving from Texas I was wondering how you were doing just the other day.

Worth

[Dutch]

Hi Anne,
It is great to see you post again!!! I think I have read every one of your posts here at tomatoville and you are a real inspiration to me! Thanks for the links too!
Dutch

[Dutch]

Hi Anne,
When you get some time you might be interested in this "snap graphing" technique Gardeneer observer. http://www.tomatoville.com/showthread.php?t=39127 Check out posts number 8 and 9.
Dutch

[Gardeneer]

I am not into reading articles and books anymore. I like to see videos. And that is where internet and Youtube come to my rescue. I have watched handful of them done by universities and individuals. The technique seems to be simple. Actually there is more than one technique.
The hard part is how to care for them after doing the grafting.
I will try to exercise a little when I grow my seedling, just as an experiment.
Gardeneer

[aclum]

Hi Worth,

Waving back at you ! I've been trying to keep up with all of your posts but it's difficult at times as you're such a prolific poster .


Dutch,

Thanks for the kind words and welcome back. I try and follow all of your posts too! Also thank you for the link about the "snap grafting." I can't visualize doing that with young seedlings but might be fun to try with older plants.


Gardeneer,

If you're not that much into reading articles, in the first link you can just "look at the pictures" - i.e. the tables at the end of the article and keep in mind this little bit from the conclusions section:

".... genetic incompatibility may be less of a concern than scheduling rootstock and scion sowing and grafting periods.......and optimizing the condition of grafting stock and grafting conditions."

In Table 2 you will see the growth rates of various rootstock (18 of them!) and 5 scion varieties. (I haven't come across anything like this in the web videos). I found the chart very helpful in selecting a rootstock, timing the sowing of my seeds, and estimating likely grafting dates. The article may or may not be of use to you .

The second link is to a number of presentations given at a grafting symposium. I found all of the ones on tomatoes interesting, but if your main concern is what to do after grafting you might like the one page "article" with a table about the effect on light on seedlings pre- and post- grafting in regards to healing and survival rate. The conclusions were a bit of a surprise to me. There is also a cool presentation about a high grower using grafted determinates that grew to 7' and produced all season long.

Anyway....good luck with your growing adventures!

Anne

[b54red]

Anne I know you are big into grafting and helped push me into it as well and for that I will be always grateful. I have after several years of trial and error worked out a system that works for me in my overly humid and air borne disease prone area. I have already done about 75 grafts and if they take as long to get to the plant out stage as last year then they should be ready somewhere around the end of February or first of March which will be fine if the weather is normal. Of course what is normal when where weather is concerned.

You might want to plant your scions a bit earlier than the RST-04-106 rootstock which I used last year with great success and it will be my main rootstock this year. I found that it grew a bit faster then the scions and had a thicker stalk even when planted 4 days later this year. In my last batch of seeds I waited almost a week before planting my rootstock seeds and I still have more of them up now than the scions. It is always easier to cut the scion off far up the plant if it is too large than to graft way up at the top of the rootstock stem in order to find similar stem dimensions.

I had the best production as far as numbers with less vegetative growth with RST-04-106-T than with Multifort, Maxifort or Estamino. I had the largest fruits and vines with Multifort and Maxifort and equally large fruit with Estamino; but with slightly smaller vines. I also had no loss from bacterial wilt with the RST rootstock but have had losses from it with all the others. I really liked it overall because it required less pruning and clipping of the vines but I did have to cull a bit more of the greenies on some varieties like Pruden's Purple, Delicious, and ISPL because of the overload of fruit set.

There were a few varieties that I tried it on that didn't do particularly well with it last year but I am going to try again this year and see if that was just a fluke. Brandywine Sudduth's, Brandywine Cowlick's, and Limbaugh's Legacy all performed better on either Estamino or Multifort than they did with RST-04-106-T. Every other variety that I used it on did very well so it could just have been the placement of the plants or the time they were set out. There are just too many variables to be sure so I am planning on trying them all side by side in the same bed again to see how they compare.

Good luck with the grafting this year.

Bill

[Gardeneer]

Bill,... I have a question:
Do you have to cut the root stock under cotyledon or you may also cut under the first true leaf node ?
I wonder if tomato plant grows suckers at the cotyledon node !!

Gardeneer

[Worth1]

Originally Posted by Gardeneer

Bill,... I have a question:
Do you have to cut the root stock under cotyledon or you may also cut under the first true leaf node ?
I wonder if tomato plant grows suckers at the cotyledon node !!

Gardeneer

I'm not Bill but I wil give my two cents.
Yes I have seen branches grow from the crotches of the cotyledon/embryonic leaves.
As for the grafting I would think it would be beast to graft above these leaves.

All of my plants are harder and more purple below them.

Worth

[aclum]

Hi Bill,

Thanks for your post. Very interesting and useful (as usual)! I think I was swayed into trying the RST-04-106-T by some of your earlier posts. I'm really excited to see how they work out for me. Your results certainly are encouraging.

I sowed both the scions and rootstock 11 days ago. Both the scions and rootstock germinated starting at day 5 and continuing over a couple of days. Right now the true leaves are just starting to develop on both the rootstock and scions and the seedlings are generally all the same size. I'll keep an eye on things and if the rootstock growth starts overtaking the scion growth, I'll try to slow down the rootstock with a change in temp and/or lighting.

I think it's interesting that most of the grafting instructions I'd seen in the past said to start rootstock 2-5 days or so before the scions! Guess they weren't using the 106's. In the past I've used the RST-04-105-T and Estamino, which, as it turns out, are the slowest growing of the rootstocks in the study I linked. (The chart seems to be in error on the 105, but in the body of the article it mentions the slow growth of the 105). Being impatient, I think I ended up grafting using a lot of too small rootstocks, accounting for most of my failures. I'm hoping to use larger seedlings and better matched stems this time around.

I haven't made a final decision yet, but I think I'll probably go with Delerium's no-root grafting technique again. That can minimize the problem of an overly long rootstock section.

That's great that you've got 75 grafted plants already! I'm trying to cut back on the number of plants I grow this year - maybe just 18 or so. But its so hard to whittle down the lists!! I'm waiting for a small order from Double Helix (that should arrive at any time) and once that arrives I'll be starting another batch of seedlings and rootstock.

Seems like I'm learning new stuff about grafting all the time (probably because I'm so forgetful these days, I'm relearning the same old stuff )!

Have fun with your grafting!

Anne

[b54red]

Originally Posted by Gardeneer

Bill,... I have a question:
Do you have to cut the root stock under cotyledon or you may also cut under the first true leaf node ?
I wonder if tomato plant grows suckers at the cotyledon node !!

Gardeneer

I used to think so from reading grafting articles but for me the most important thing is to graft where the stems match in both shape and size. Some of my grafts are only an inch or so above the root ball and others will be six or seven inches up the plant. As to sprouting I just pinch off everything below the graft. The higher up the rootstock stem that you make the graft the more sprouting I have to deal with; but that is a minor issue. I can't tell any difference in production or growth in where the graft is made on the rootstock. I do know that if the graft is too low it is hard to prevent rooting from the scion which defeats the whole purpose of grafting for me.

Bill

[b54red]

Originally Posted by aclum

Hi Bill,

Thanks for your post. Very interesting and useful (as usual)! I think I was swayed into trying the RST-04-106-T by some of your earlier posts. I'm really excited to see how they work out for me. Your results certainly are encouraging.

I sowed both the scions and rootstock 11 days ago. Both the scions and rootstock germinated starting at day 5 and continuing over a couple of days. Right now the true leaves are just starting to develop on both the rootstock and scions and the seedlings are generally all the same size. I'll keep an eye on things and if the rootstock growth starts overtaking the scion growth, I'll try to slow down the rootstock with a change in temp and/or lighting.

I think it's interesting that most of the grafting instructions I'd seen in the past said to start rootstock 2-5 days or so before the scions! Guess they weren't using the 106's. In the past I've used the RST-04-105-T and Estamino, which, as it turns out, are the slowest growing of the rootstocks in the study I linked. (The chart seems to be in error on the 105, but in the body of the article it mentions the slow growth of the 105). Being impatient, I think I ended up grafting using a lot of too small rootstocks, accounting for most of my failures. I'm hoping to use larger seedlings and better matched stems this time around.

I haven't made a final decision yet, but I think I'll probably go with Delerium's no-root grafting technique again. That can minimize the problem of an overly long rootstock section.

That's great that you've got 75 grafted plants already! I'm trying to cut back on the number of plants I grow this year - maybe just 18 or so. But its so hard to whittle down the lists!! I'm waiting for a small order from Double Helix (that should arrive at any time) and once that arrives I'll be starting another batch of seedlings and rootstock.

Seems like I'm learning new stuff about grafting all the time (probably because I'm so forgetful these days, I'm relearning the same old stuff )!

Have fun with your grafting!

Anne

Anne,

So far my results are running in the 90% or higher range but that will drop down as the temps get higher. I find that the plants heal more successfully when the temperatures are lower. I have been doing all of my grafting this year in my tiny greenhouse and putting my healing chambers under my main work shelf on the floor until the chamber is opened completely then I move the cups into a shallower tray where more light can get to them until I repot them.

I will explain what I do and you might want to try it as my results since starting to use this method have been very consistent with few failures.

I first get a half a regular old style razor blade, a clean plastic cutting board, a bunch of clips from 1.5m to 3m.

next: I try to find two plants whose stems match in size somewhere and then I pull the rootstock out of the DE it is in and pull off at least half the roots and trim the leaves up to near the top. I then cut off the scion near the soil line and trim it up good leaving a few small leaves at the top but not many because when they have too many leaves it can cause them to tilt too much to one side or the other and pull the graft apart causing failure.

Next: Lay the two stems on top of each other and line up where the stems match and make a diagonal cut through them both. Make sure to keep up with which one is the scion and which is the rootstock. Then clip the scion to the rootstock making sure the graft is clean and holding it up to a light to make sure the contact is good between them.

Next: Take a normal 8oz Styrofoam coffee cup with a good number of small holes punched in the bottom and fill it to about a half inch from the top with a larger granule DE. The one I use is called Optisorb and I get it at O'Reilly Auto Parts in a 30 lb bag for about 17 dollars. Then I wet it thoroughly with diluted TTF fertilizer. Most of it will flow out the holes leaving just moist DE. I then take my finger and make a hole in the moist DE as deep as needed (this can take a little wiggling to acheive). Then place the graft into the hole as deep as needed pushing the DE back to hold it upright. Then check it again against a light to make sure the graft joint hasn't shifted or opened up any. If it has re-position the two stems to match the way they should. It is best if the graft is standing as vertical as possible so you may have to make the planting hole at an angle to achieve this. It is amazing how crooked some of the stems can be.

Next take some dry DE out of the bag and surround the stem with about a half inch so the top is covered with the dry DE and use as much as needed to help support the stem at the angle you want it. Then place it in a clean deep clear plastic container with a lid. Make sure to mist the inside and inside of the lid before you use the healing chamber. Place the lid back on top and do the next graft. When you have finished the grafts wet the inside of the lid of the healing chamber again and close it up good. Leave it for 24 hrs or up to two days before opening it up for a bit then close it back but just set the lid back on top and don't clasp it shut from now on. You can open it for a few minutes a couple of times a day and after 4 or 5 days leave the lid cracked for a few hours and then check the plants. If they haven't wilted then each day open it more until you leave the lid off entirely and give them a dose of the diluted fertilizer water. If at anytime most of the grafts start wilting too much then mist the inside of the lid and seal it up for a while and see how they do. Then go back to giving them more air and light each day.

Next: After leaving the healing chamber open for a day or two I move the grafts to a totally open shallow tray and let them grow for another week or so them move them outside. After a week or so outside I usually repot them into a good potting soil and let them grow some more. I like to use a wooden or bamboo kebab skewer to support them at this point as they are getting taller with more foliage to catch the wind. During this time it is important not to expose them to too much wind unless you have the supported with a skewer to stop them from bending or separating at the graft joint. I also start pinching or cutting off any sprouts that come out below the graft. When they really start growing good I can them remove the clips that haven't popped off from the growth of the stem. Sometimes at this point the graft will separate even though the plant looks great. Don't know why this happens and it is rare unless you remove the clips too soon.

Next: I let the plants go through at least one good drying out then fertilize them well with TTF and set them out. Make sure to support them until they are at least a foot or more tall because spring winds can still cause the graft joint to break at this early stage. I use tall skewers and a piece of surveyors thin plastic tape to tie the graft to the skewer. I usually do this as soon as I pot them up into potting soil and just leave the skewer in the root ball when I plant them out.

Anne it is funny what you said about Estamino being the slowest. When I planted out my last batch of both scions and rootstock the first up were Estamino even though they were planted 5 days later than the scion seed. Maybe it was that they were those pelleted seed I had left from last year. I had the best germination with them than any other rootstock seed. I didn't see them on the Paramount site available in Estamino this year. I still had enough of both Estamino and Multifort to use them on the varieties that did the best for me with each rootstock and I am going to do most of my grafting onto the RST-04-106-T this year since it did better overall last year. Of course you know what that means.

Bill

[aclum]

Hi Bill,

Great post! Maybe it should be made into a sticky or its own thread for easy reference. (I especially liked all the detail on your post grafting routine).

A couple of questions...... What do you do in regard to watering both the RS and scions prior to grafting - like the day or evening before? Also, what's the approximate temperature range in your greenhouse?

I'd forgotten about your RS root trimming prior to grafting technique. I may give it a try since it's worked so well for you. That 90% success rate is pretty impressive. Although I never achieved it, I think Delerium was getting close to 100% with his no-root grafting technique. I may try both methods side by side. If they work equally well, one might chose one technique over the other depending on how high (or low) on the stem you need to make the cut for a stem diameter match.

I've had great results in the past using the DE and dilute TTF but I've switched over to Wonder Soil (I started a thread on it a while back). I have respiratory issues and I should be wearing a respirator (which I don't have and wouldn't want to use anyway) if I use DE due to all the fine dust knocked up. The Wonder Soil seems cleaner than the DE to me and it seems to work at least just as well.

As I recall , the Estamino and RST-04-105-T that I used in the past germinated more or less in the same time frame as the scions but they grew a lot slower than the scions. So far this year, the RST-04-106-T and my scions have germinated and are growing at approximately the same rate (although this could change as grafting day approaches).

Looking forward to trying out some of your grafting techniques in a couple of days now.

Anne

[rwsacto]

Bill,

Thank you for the detailed grafting instructions. I am just starting germination and will be using rootstock shoots held over from last year, including supernatural and RST-04-106T. I rooted the tops from last year and kept them in pots in the garage with a couple of CFL lights.

In your instructions, after grafting, are you covering the graft (and clip) with DE?

Thanks,
Rick

[b54red]

Originally Posted by aclum

Hi Bill,

Great post! Maybe it should be made into a sticky or its own thread for easy reference. (I especially liked all the detail on your post grafting routine).

A couple of questions...... What do you do in regard to watering both the RS and scions prior to grafting - like the day or evening before? Also, what's the approximate temperature range in your greenhouse?

I'd forgotten about your RS root trimming prior to grafting technique. I may give it a try since it's worked so well for you. That 90% success rate is pretty impressive. Although I never achieved it, I think Delerium was getting close to 100% with his no-root grafting technique. I may try both methods side by side. If they work equally well, one might chose one technique over the other depending on how high (or low) on the stem you need to make the cut for a stem diameter match.

I've had great results in the past using the DE and dilute TTF but I've switched over to Wonder Soil (I started a thread on it a while back). I have respiratory issues and I should be wearing a respirator (which I don't have and wouldn't want to use anyway) if I use DE due to all the fine dust knocked up. The Wonder Soil seems cleaner than the DE to me and it seems to work at least just as well.

As I recall , the Estamino and RST-04-105-T that I used in the past germinated more or less in the same time frame as the scions but they grew a lot slower than the scions. So far this year, the RST-04-106-T and my scions have germinated and are growing at approximately the same rate (although this could change as grafting day approaches).

Looking forward to trying out some of your grafting techniques in a couple of days now.

Anne

Anne, I'll try to answer your questions if I can.

As to watering before grafting: I try not to water the rootstock for about 8 hrs or more before the grafting and I try to water the scions well about an hour before grafting. This is to prevent too much water coming up the stem and causing the graft to separate. That is also the reason I pull the bulk of the roots off the scion just before I make my cut and it also makes it easier to set down into the moist DE. Of course sometimes I get the watering wrong or the rootstock is wilting so I will water them but that usually makes grafting less successful.

As to the temperature range in the greenhouse: It can be anywhere from upper 30s on cold nights to upper 70s when the sun is shining and the day is in the high 50s or low 60s. Once temps outside get into the upper 60s and above I usually run my small air conditioner to keep the temps below 80 in the daytime and turn it off at night.

The reason I went to the larger particle DE was because the small stuff stayed too wet and caused too much moisture to rise up the stem and it also created too much moisture inside the healing chamber resulting in too many incidences of damping off but still far less than potting soil. The larger DE has much less dust and I have lung problems also and have had no problems using the larger DE. It seems to maintain the perfect balance of moisture and by putting the dry DE on the surface before putting it in the healing chamber it seems to have almost totally eliminated my problems with damping off. It is so much easier to deal with. It is almost like a very small gravel. I still use the small size DE for my small seed starting but I am careful of the dust.

Bill