Salty soil the secret to sweet tomatoes?

peebee · May 23, 2017

Below is a posting I just cut & pasted here, in reply to Fred Hempel's post about sea beans. I wanted some opinions on what I wrote:

I watched a program in Japanese last week about tomatoes. What intrigued me was the story behind one farm that was flooded by seawater several years ago during a natural disaster (I believe it was a devastating typhoon). The farmer thought all was lost, but decided he might as well go ahead and plant his tomato crop as planned, after the water level went down. The tomatoes were smaller than usual at harvest, so he did not have high hopes as they were planted in ruined soil anyways. The tomatoes turned out to be so sweet, he later marketed them as Fruit Tomatoes. Ever since, he has grown them in soil that has high salt content. He showed the soil on camera, and there was clearly white powdering on the surface. How he "salts" his soil was not discussed, but he did say the salt AND scant watering both contributed to his extra sweet fruits. These Fruit Tomatoes are popular among children in Japan especially.
I know that decreasing the watering towards the end of harvest is a common method here, it aids in intensifying the flavor. But high salt (like the kind in cow manure, for example) is a no-no. Now I'm wondering if perhaps we are wrong about this, or perhaps sea water is beneficial cuz it contains other nutrients which the manure does not have?
Have anyone near the shore ever heard of watering tomato plants with sea water? Not that I think it would be the same as having salted soil. Just wondering.

HudsonValley · May 23, 2017

The agricultural folks at Rutgers University in NJ have tested this, using sea water on tomato plants, but only on a small scale: http://njfarmfresh.rutgers.edu/docum...matoFlavor.pdf

(I wondered about this two years ago, when it dawned on me as a first-time gardener that my plants would be watered with softened water from my well. It's not exactly sea water, but it's definitely salted. Tomatoes do just fine here, and they taste great.)

KarenO · May 23, 2017

"salt" does not always mean sodium chloride, what we all commonly call salt.
Other minerals form crystals also considered "salts"
Magnesium sulphide for example, commonly called Epsom salts.
I would not presume that the "salt" referred to is sodium chloride.
Karen O

Worth1 · May 23, 2017

Probably the tsunami disaster flooded the fields.

They make magnesium and chlorine from sea water.
I have seen the whole process from beginning to the end product of magnesium ingots and chlorine.

If he is using sea water sooner or lather the fields will be barren and worthless.
Worth

Wi-sunflower · May 23, 2017

I believe that is a post here somewhere about how they grow greenhouse winter tomatoes and salt is involved there too. but eventually the soil will be dead using too much salt.

Carol

Ricky Shaw · May 23, 2017

Putting this in the, "Do Not Attempt at Home", category, I struggle growing them in regular ways.

Cole_Robbie · May 23, 2017

You can actually buy sea salt as a fertilizer: https://seaagri.com/

I think there is also another factor involved in the Japanese tomatoes. The salt is placing a stress on the plants, but the end result is positive. It's similar to the way drought tomatoes taste sweeter from water stress and hot peppers get hotter. Hydroponic tomato growers have drastically increased the PPM of their nutrient solution a few days before harvest, to re-create a similar environment. It's using plant stress in a beneficial way.

maxjohnson · May 23, 2017

Yeah just be careful of your application with those Sea90. I over did it, and it did more harm than good.

00mimi00 · May 23, 2017

I used Sea90 last year with good results and using again this year. Also, my Okinawa purple sweet potatoes were wonderful last year and I think it's was the Sea90 and lava sand combo. It's not just sea salt, but mineral content. Use sparingly. I did it foliar and the tomatoes leaves didn't take to it so well. Later I tossed a couple tablespoons on top of the soil in the 30 gal fabric pots and watered in with seaweed and I know it's anecdotal but that plants liked it. It could be just the seaweed, but the plants get seaweed all the time. They are better. Though I haven't measured it, the Sea90 was beneficial.

00mimi00 · May 23, 2017

Not just the salt, but the minerals. I read a study somewhere about a place where a tsunami happened the vegetables that grew back a few years later were extremely productive and the best tasting.

Labradors2 · May 23, 2017

I won't be trying it!

I had a disasterous seed-growing season this year and I strongly suspect that it was due to my use of softened water. In previous years, I've always saved my leftover tea and dog water for watering my plants. Reverse Osmosis water is used for those.

This spring, I decided to water my seedlings with WARM water (from the hot tap because my basement was barely 60 degrees). My seedlings were stunted, yellow, and dropped their lower leaves. Compared to plants grown by my friend, which were germinated at the same time as mine, hers were 2' tall when mine were still 3-4" tall and it eventually dawned on me that perhaps the medium wasn't to blame but my salty water!!!!

BTW the medium was "Pro Plan for Vegetables and Herbs". There is nothing wrong with it, but I had used something different previously so it was my primary suspect.

Linda

BigVanVader · May 23, 2017

Hmm...I will have to invent a garden tsunami machine to sell to adventurous gardeners.

kurt · May 23, 2017

Go figure,your best kelp fertilizers are derived from cold water kelps.All from the sea.

Jimbotomateo · May 23, 2017

Quote:

Originally Posted by kurt

Go figure,your best kelp fertilizers are derived from cold water kelps.All from the sea.

When I gathered sea weed for compost pile most of the sites I checked stated it wasn't really necessary to wash the salt off. Now that makes more sense to me than it did then.

**carolyn137** · May 23, 2017

Tomatoes grown in Israel are grown with salty water,which is abundant there, and they are exported to many countries including the US and are praised for their sweet taste

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q...on+salty+water

There's also another place in the US SW that does the same, I just can't remember the name right now.

Carolyn, also noting that a former friend of mine was financially supporting the Israeli tomato growing industry. Said person had several boxes shipped to the US for both of us and had someone drive them up to me,so yes, I can vouch for the sweetness myself. It wasn't just one variety, they grew beefsteaks,cherries and on the vine ones as wsell.

May 23, 2017	#1
peebee Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Southern CA Posts: 1,714	Salty soil the secret to sweet tomatoes? Below is a posting I just cut & pasted here, in reply to Fred Hempel's post about sea beans. I wanted some opinions on what I wrote: I watched a program in Japanese last week about tomatoes. What intrigued me was the story behind one farm that was flooded by seawater several years ago during a natural disaster (I believe it was a devastating typhoon). The farmer thought all was lost, but decided he might as well go ahead and plant his tomato crop as planned, after the water level went down. The tomatoes were smaller than usual at harvest, so he did not have high hopes as they were planted in ruined soil anyways. The tomatoes turned out to be so sweet, he later marketed them as Fruit Tomatoes. Ever since, he has grown them in soil that has high salt content. He showed the soil on camera, and there was clearly white powdering on the surface. How he "salts" his soil was not discussed, but he did say the salt AND scant watering both contributed to his extra sweet fruits. These Fruit Tomatoes are popular among children in Japan especially. I know that decreasing the watering towards the end of harvest is a common method here, it aids in intensifying the flavor. But high salt (like the kind in cow manure, for example) is a no-no. Now I'm wondering if perhaps we are wrong about this, or perhaps sea water is beneficial cuz it contains other nutrients which the manure does not have? Have anyone near the shore ever heard of watering tomato plants with sea water? Not that I think it would be the same as having salted soil. Just wondering.

May 23, 2017	#9
00mimi00 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Dallas TX Posts: 10	I used Sea90 last year with good results and using again this year. Also, my Okinawa purple sweet potatoes were wonderful last year and I think it's was the Sea90 and lava sand combo. It's not just sea salt, but mineral content. Use sparingly. I did it foliar and the tomatoes leaves didn't take to it so well. Later I tossed a couple tablespoons on top of the soil in the 30 gal fabric pots and watered in with seaweed and I know it's anecdotal but that plants liked it. It could be just the seaweed, but the plants get seaweed all the time. They are better. Though I haven't measured it, the Sea90 was beneficial. Last edited by 00mimi00; May 23, 2017 at 11:56 AM.

May 23, 2017	#11
Labradors2 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Ontario Posts: 3,896	I won't be trying it! I had a disasterous seed-growing season this year and I strongly suspect that it was due to my use of softened water. In previous years, I've always saved my leftover tea and dog water for watering my plants. Reverse Osmosis water is used for those. This spring, I decided to water my seedlings with WARM water (from the hot tap because my basement was barely 60 degrees). My seedlings were stunted, yellow, and dropped their lower leaves. Compared to plants grown by my friend, which were germinated at the same time as mine, hers were 2' tall when mine were still 3-4" tall and it eventually dawned on me that perhaps the medium wasn't to blame but my salty water!!!! BTW the medium was "Pro Plan for Vegetables and Herbs". There is nothing wrong with it, but I had used something different previously so it was my primary suspect. Linda Last edited by Labradors2; May 23, 2017 at 12:10 PM.

May 23, 2017	#13
kurt Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Homestead,Everglades City Fl. Posts: 2,500	Go figure,your best kelp fertilizers are derived from cold water kelps.All from the sea. __________________ KURT

May 23, 2017	#15
carolyn137 Moderator Emeritus Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a Posts: 21,169	Tomatoes grown in Israel are grown with salty water,which is abundant there, and they are exported to many countries including the US and are praised for their sweet taste https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q...on+salty+water There's also another place in the US SW that does the same, I just can't remember the name right now. Carolyn, also noting that a former friend of mine was financially supporting the Israeli tomato growing industry. Said person had several boxes shipped to the US for both of us and had someone drive them up to me,so yes, I can vouch for the sweetness myself. It wasn't just one variety, they grew beefsteaks,cherries and on the vine ones as wsell. __________________ Carolyn

May 23, 2017	#2
HudsonValley Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: Hudson Valley, NY, Zone 6a Posts: 626	The agricultural folks at Rutgers University in NJ have tested this, using sea water on tomato plants, but only on a small scale: http://njfarmfresh.rutgers.edu/docum...matoFlavor.pdf (I wondered about this two years ago, when it dawned on me as a first-time gardener that my plants would be watered with softened water from my well. It's not exactly sea water, but it's definitely salted. Tomatoes do just fine here, and they taste great.)

May 23, 2017	#3
KarenO Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Vancouver Island Posts: 5,931	"salt" does not always mean sodium chloride, what we all commonly call salt. Other minerals form crystals also considered "salts" Magnesium sulphide for example, commonly called Epsom salts. I would not presume that the "salt" referred to is sodium chloride. Karen O

May 23, 2017	#4
Worth1 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Den of Drunken Fools Posts: 38,539	Probably the tsunami disaster flooded the fields. They make magnesium and chlorine from sea water. I have seen the whole process from beginning to the end product of magnesium ingots and chlorine. If he is using sea water sooner or lather the fields will be barren and worthless. Worth

May 23, 2017	#5
Wi-sunflower Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 2,591	I believe that is a post here somewhere about how they grow greenhouse winter tomatoes and salt is involved there too. but eventually the soil will be dead using too much salt. Carol

May 23, 2017	#6
Ricky Shaw Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Aug 2015 Location: Zone 6a Denver North Metro Posts: 1,910	Putting this in the, "Do Not Attempt at Home", category, I struggle growing them in regular ways.

May 23, 2017	#7
Cole_Robbie Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Illinois, zone 6 Posts: 8,407	You can actually buy sea salt as a fertilizer: https://seaagri.com/ I think there is also another factor involved in the Japanese tomatoes. The salt is placing a stress on the plants, but the end result is positive. It's similar to the way drought tomatoes taste sweeter from water stress and hot peppers get hotter. Hydroponic tomato growers have drastically increased the PPM of their nutrient solution a few days before harvest, to re-create a similar environment. It's using plant stress in a beneficial way.

May 23, 2017	#8
maxjohnson Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: OH 6a Posts: 592	Yeah just be careful of your application with those Sea90. I over did it, and it did more harm than good.

May 23, 2017	#12
BigVanVader Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Greenville, South Carolina Posts: 3,099	Hmm...I will have to invent a garden tsunami machine to sell to adventurous gardeners.