One last crack at Brandywine.

[michael johnson]

I am having one last crack at trying to get the original brandywine with flavour-that has so far eluded me, I was fortunate enough for another TV member who sent me some very well sealed Brandywine seeds from Johnny's selected seeds, that were about ten years old, also some Brandywine Joyce's that were roughly the same age.

Using the plastic bag zip lock method I managed to get two out of ten Johnny's seeds to germinate, but was a bit luckier with the Joyce's as several of those germinated ok.

So- if all goes well, I should be able to taste the results about mid august, If I fail to get the right taste this time-then thats it- I wont bother to grow brandywines again,the taste of all the other variations of it I have tried have been ok but nothing special and I have yet to discover what all the fuss has been about, in fact I much prefer the Brandywine Red Landis valley strain, for flavour and a better growing strong plant, and to my way of thinking the flavour beats the other brandywines hands down.

This year I am going to try the horse manure /seaweed mix around the base of the new Brandywines to see if that makes any difference to the flavour.

[carolyn137]

If I fail to get the right taste

*****

Michael, how are you going to know if you get the "right" taste or not? What is the "right" taste?

I'm one of many who does not consider Brandywine to be the best tasting variety around. I do think it has a unique taste, but then so do Prue and a few others for me as well.

Just so you know what you have:

Johnny's Brandywine is the Sudduth/Quisenberry strain sent to them by Craig. I don't know why the 10 yo seeds b'c what they sell now they sold 10 years ago, as from Craig. And many places have that strain now that didn't years ago and many places have that strain and don't know they do.

Joyce's Brandywine is a selection that Chuck Wyatt made from the Sudduth/Quisenberry strain for earliness, but it isn't any earlier than that from which it was selected according to most who have grown it, and that includes me as well.

So I don't see Brandywine as being the acme of tomato taste and I don't think anyone should. The hyoe is out there but for those of us who grow heirloom tomatoes I think we know that taste can vary for many reasons.

As for the other varieties with Brandywine as part of the name I do think that some of them are fine tasting varieties, but as you said above, you don't, except for Red Brandywine, which just goes to show you that taste is perceptual, has a human genetic association and so your taste perception for Brandywine may well be different from all others b'c it's your genes at work, your soil, your weather, your amendments and all the other variables that come into play.

[michael johnson]

I know, I agree with you totaly about the many variations of soil, taste etc, but for me- any improvement in taste from the past Brandywines in previous years will be enough to convince me, and still keep growing it,

The only trouble is that when I read all those other folks who go into raptures over their brandywines being the best tasting tomatoes-I start to drool a bit, and still think I am missing out on something - its the mental image one tends to conjure up that drives one on to new depths.

The ten year old seeds -came from a very kind person, who is also a TV member, and a terrific tomato grower, who was the only one that answered my ad in the wanted section for some Johnny's selected seed BW's, and he kindly offered them to me saying that he had stored them all that time in ideal conditions, and if I wanted to take the chance and try and get some of them to germinate ,then I could have them to try, there was also some Joyce's strain in the offer as well, so naturaly I was delighted, and also the fact that because they were ten years old at least, they would be much nearer the original strain without being altered slightly along the way.

Since that time we have exchanged quite a lot of different seeds (More modern varieties) many times back and forth accross the pond, and I consider him to be one of my bestest and most respected friends-which I hope will continue for many years to come.


But Brandywine has always intrigued me and continues to do so-until I unravel the mystery

[peppereater]

I have always been mystified by why Carolyn doesn't care that much for Brandywine. My first year growing heirlooms, I got seed from Totally Tomatoes. I have no idea of the origin, but the Brandywine I grew that year and several years after was hands down the best tomato I have ever eaten. Nothing else has ever compared. I will say, though, that the whole notion of soil, climate, etc. may be a HUGE factor, because that first year, I also grew Kellogg's Breakfast, and I got small, tasteless fruit. I didn't try the KB again for several years, but decided to grow them just to use the leftover seed. MAN! They were exquisite, but even so, they didn't have the full-on, "acid" taste of a red or pink tomato that I crave. I'm growing BW, Red BW and Sudduths this year, hopefully I'll get to compare tastes and report on them later.!

[Tomstrees]

I received seeds in trade from a productive "Brandywine" that was grown out in 2006. I'm going to plant 2 plants, give it the "center" spot in my garden and see what this "hoop-la" is all about ...

I'm hoping for at least 1 tomato for me to try (( I'm sure I'll get more)) ... People say the taste is really, really good ...

Michael - if things don't work out, or even if they do, try
"Pink Potato Top" ... the flavor of this tomato is OUTSTANDING, and is VERY productive ~

~ Tom

[feldon30]

I consider Brandywine Sudduth's to be fantastic in flavor. But Cherokee Purple edges it out a bit. I have not had the pleasure of Prue, but since Suze is growing 2-3 plants, I'll hopefully get to try it.

Without paying attention, I ended up growing 3 heart-shaped varieties this year -- Anna Russian, Wes, and Brad's Black Heart. Alas my Orange Russian #117 seedlings never got big enough to fuss with, otherwise I would have been growing 4 hearts. I'll have to depend on Suze for a taste of Neves Azorean Red as well as those seedlings didn't do much.

[Tomstrees]

ahhh .... NAR = heat lover, great production, & flavor ~

~ Tom

[carolyn137]

Dave, I like Brandywine well enough, I do, but I don't go into raptures and swoon when the name is mentioned.

For many years I was the unofficial Prez of the anti-Brandywine Association of America b'c I just didn't get it, but then Craig sent me the Sudduth strain in the early 90's and that really did make the difference for me. B'c before that there used to be quite a few different strains listed in the SSE Yearbooks and I grew many of them to no avail.

Fact is, strains for some varieties don't differ at all and the strain name just indicates the name of the person who listed it or whatever. Same situation exists for Mortgage Lifter altho the Mullens strain is different in having a pale leaf.

Michael, since the variety Brandywine is reputed to be now over 100 years old, getting 10 yo seed isn't going to help you much in getting something close to the original.

There are many of us SSE members who have Quisenberry's Brandywine and SSE has also been offering it in the public catalog, as received from Ben Quisenberry and many commercial places have carried it for quite a few years now.

I hope you do find the taste you think you're looking for.

[montanamato]

I am also in Carolyn's camp on this one....I grew many op and heirlooms long before I heard of Brandywine....When I firsttasted it, I thought it was a bit over rated...I always assumed most people have a special place for it because it was the first or one of the first heirlooms they tried...It is a horribly fussy plant in my climate, and I feel it has probably done as much to hurt OP tomatoes as good, because most people I know who buy the plants are so discouraged they go back to hybrids and stay...Just my feelings, and I know it performs great in many other areas. I have long ago given it's space to others....A good tomato, just too finicky for my garden, when others I like as well (or better) are reliable...

Jeanne

[Downinmyback]

I guess i had to be a oddball then because i still think BRANDYWINE taste better than any tomato i have eaten. As a matter of fact it was the reason for me switching to heirlooms.. Brandywine are a pain in the south but i guess that what makes everyone want it. I get one crop about two weeks then nothing else til late October. I am trying alot of new varieties this year so maybe i will find one to take the place of Brandywine lol.

[landarc]

I think it is definitely about soil and climate, as Brandywine Sudduths has not been good in my yard. I have it form others, and it is better from someone else's soil. That said, it is not the tomato I reach for first in any case as the flavour isn't great for me.

[michael johnson]

Personaly-so far the better flavoured tomato so far has been Neves Azorean Red for me, but its such a horrible plant to grow in the first place- all stalk an leaves-very sturdy and robust,but so very late in producing flowers and fruit- mine had no flower trusses on it until late july last year then it started to produce fruit and flower trusses like mad until mid october, wonderfull flavour.

Tom- am trying pink potato top for the first time this year-so I am hoping

I personaly think the Brandywine saga- points to the fact that BW sudduth is indeed a very fussy plant-in the fact that if the soil conditions and certain elements in the soil are not present, and /or the right manure and feed combination plus climate etc, then you just dont get the flavour people rave about, but you will get a fairly good flavour instead- thats just acceptable.

If all the people who rave about the BW flavour of theirs were to compare notes- there must be a common denominator in there somewhere-and pinpoint the missing link.

It appears to be the same- with those rare (Blaby's Special) tomatoes that I obtained, according to the research from the original tomato growers vast greenhouse complex where they grew them- what gave then their flavour was the compost made up of organic grass fed horse manure, peat from the new forest area and the loam type soil,

Obviously they had originaly trialed them both with and without the best compost and compared results

[elkwc36]

Montanamato descriped my feelings and experiences with Brandywine Sudduth exactly. I know several growers who tried it and went back to hybrids. The same way with greenhouse owners. As I've stated here it has very limited results. And the taste I've received there is many better. JME. Jay

[Ruth_10]

Brandywine Sudduth is tops for me. Great production, healthy plants, flavor just what I want in a tomato. OTOH, I tried Cherokee Purple for three years running and the plants didn't do well and the few fruit I got were--okay. One of these days I will search out another source of CP (original was TGS).

[PaulF]

For me in two different areas of the midwest, Brandywine-Sudduth has had an excellent flavor. Although the production has been relatively low, the Mmmmm was worth the growing.

Originally the seeds I got were from Chuck Wyatt and I have saved seeds from four generations. In order to freshen my supply and be sure to get the real thing again I ordered from Johnnies and SSE. I grew plants from each source and compared. They all seemed to be the same....even my saved seed.

While Brandywine is very good in flavor, I too like Neve's Azorean. Cherokee Purple , Carbon, Caspian Pink and Kellogg's Breakfast also rate higher for me than BW-S.