define "black tomato"

paul2101 · July 17, 2007

For all the talk of "black" tomatoes, I've never really seen one. They all look dark purple to me

Are there any truly black tomatoes (not just in name - but in true color)?

If I've created a very dark purple tomato, what characteristics would lead me to name it a black tomato? Are there some special characteristics of skin or flesh color that I would use to make this determination?

Earl · July 17, 2007

Could be they just look black from a distance?

**nctomatoman** · July 17, 2007

I'm not sure where the "black" descriptor came from, though I suspect it is from tomatoes such as Black from Tula and Black Krim, early examples of the type. What it means these days is a tomato whose color is a combination of its hue, combined with retained chlorophyll when it is ripe - so you get the red of the flesh combined with the retained green pigment, plus the seeds tend to have greenish gel - this leads to a very dark crimson flesh; if the skin is clear, it is a dusky pink or purple, as in Cherokee Purple or Black from Tula. if the skin is yellow, it makes the tomato look burnt orange or brick to brown, as in Cherokee Chocolate or Paul Robeson. Often, when the fruit is allowed to fully ripen, the hue can get quite distinctly deep - not really black, but quite dark.

paul2101 · July 17, 2007

Craig,

When I mixed Cherokee Purple with Stupice, I did get some of those "burn't orange" colors - I thought they were very ugly

In F5 of my project, I'm getting a dark tomato with green shoulders. There was nothing like this in F3 or F4. F2 had a few that were quite dark but I did not carry them forward.

Paul

Tomstrees · July 18, 2007

For me the "hue" is everything is regards to black tomatoes.
Black from Tula has been the darkest of the black varieties for me.

~ Tom

peispud · July 18, 2007

The "blackest" tomato I've grown so far has been this Purple Passion variety. From the top, the green shoulders made it look almost all black when it was on the plant, but viewed from the bottom the tomato was a deep dark purple.

dcarch · July 18, 2007

I have been eating lots of Carbon this year. Got another four big ones today. The color is very similar to Tom's Black from Tula, except no green shoulder.

Off topic. There is no "white" tomato either.

dcarch

**Lee** · July 18, 2007

Quote:

Off topic. There is no "white" tomato either.

Perhaps "ivory" is a better description, but these are definitely lighter than
most yellows.

Lee

"On topic"

Here's a picture that shows the distinctive "black" coloring of a couple of tomatoes.

**nctomatoman** · July 18, 2007

The whitest tomato I've seen in awhile popped out unexpectedly in the dwarf project - I bet you can spot it in this basket, next to some very pale yellow fruit!

Fusion_power · July 20, 2007

Just so you get to see a really really black one Paul. It is in my garden now and I took the photo about a week ago.

Suze · July 20, 2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fusion_power

Just so you get to see a really really black one Paul. It is in my garden now and I took the photo about a week ago.

It's a shame you can't share the seeds, though.

What's the story on when seeds might be available for it?

ddsack · July 20, 2007

Now THAT is really black, Fusion!
Kind of reminds me of the ripe berries on the "deadly" nightshade weed!

And what do these taste like?

Dee

Fusion_power · July 20, 2007

Lol Dee, that is truly the tough part.

They actually have a fairly intense tomato flavor when fully ripe. But they have very little if any sweetness. The anthocyanin gives them overtones of blackberries and they have an aftertaste that I can only describe as acrid.

If I were being kind, they might rate a 5 out of 10. But I am not growing them for flavor. They are for breeding. I would love to see these crossed with Black From Tula or maybe Paul Robeson or Cherokee Purple.

Fusion

amideutch · July 20, 2007

Fusion, very interesting. Was this an intentional/unintentional cross. A little history please. Ami

Fusion_power · July 20, 2007

Not my creation Ami. These are from Jim Myers at Oregon State University. He developed them from a cross using a wild peruvian tomato that expresses the anthocyanin gene aft. I had to pay $20 and sign a non-propagation agreement to get seed. I CAN use them for crosses but Jim Myers requested a chance to see what I come up with.

I have one tomato that expresses Aubergine which gives purple color to the skin of the tomato. i would like to cross it with this tomato to get both the skin and the flesh colored as dark as possible.

Darrel

July 17, 2007	#1
paul2101 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Maryland Posts: 19	define "black tomato" For all the talk of "black" tomatoes, I've never really seen one. They all look dark purple to me Are there any truly black tomatoes (not just in name - but in true color)? If I've created a very dark purple tomato, what characteristics would lead me to name it a black tomato? Are there some special characteristics of skin or flesh color that I would use to make this determination?

July 17, 2007	#2
Earl Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: SW Ohio Posts: 1,278	Could be they just look black from a distance? __________________ "Seriously think about what you're about to do/say before you do it and the outcome will always be better." Earl

July 17, 2007	#3
nctomatoman Tomatoville® Moderator Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Hendersonville, NC zone 7 Posts: 10,385	I'm not sure where the "black" descriptor came from, though I suspect it is from tomatoes such as Black from Tula and Black Krim, early examples of the type. What it means these days is a tomato whose color is a combination of its hue, combined with retained chlorophyll when it is ripe - so you get the red of the flesh combined with the retained green pigment, plus the seeds tend to have greenish gel - this leads to a very dark crimson flesh; if the skin is clear, it is a dusky pink or purple, as in Cherokee Purple or Black from Tula. if the skin is yellow, it makes the tomato look burnt orange or brick to brown, as in Cherokee Chocolate or Paul Robeson. Often, when the fruit is allowed to fully ripen, the hue can get quite distinctly deep - not really black, but quite dark. __________________ Craig

July 18, 2007	#5
Tomstrees Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: NJ Bayshore Posts: 3,848	For me the "hue" is everything is regards to black tomatoes. Black from Tula has been the darkest of the black varieties for me. ~ Tom __________________ My green thumb came only as a result of the mistakes I made while learning to see things from the plant's point of view. ~ H. Fred Ale

July 18, 2007	#7
dcarch Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: NY Posts: 2,618	I have been eating lots of Carbon this year. Got another four big ones today. The color is very similar to Tom's Black from Tula, except no green shoulder. Off topic. There is no "white" tomato either. dcarch __________________ tomatomatomatomatomatomatomatomatomatomatomatomato matomato tomatomatomatomatomatomatomatomatomatomatomatomato matomato tomatomatomatomatomatomatomatomatomatomatomatomato matomato

July 18, 2007	#6
peispud Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 180	The "blackest" tomato I've grown so far has been this Purple Passion variety. From the top, the green shoulders made it look almost all black when it was on the plant, but viewed from the bottom the tomato was a deep dark purple.

July 20, 2007	#12
ddsack Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Northern Minnesota - zone 3 Posts: 3,231	Now THAT is really black, Fusion! Kind of reminds me of the ripe berries on the "deadly" nightshade weed! And what do these taste like? Dee

July 20, 2007	#13
Fusion_power Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Alabama Posts: 2,250	Lol Dee, that is truly the tough part. They actually have a fairly intense tomato flavor when fully ripe. But they have very little if any sweetness. The anthocyanin gives them overtones of blackberries and they have an aftertaste that I can only describe as acrid. If I were being kind, they might rate a 5 out of 10. But I am not growing them for flavor. They are for breeding. I would love to see these crossed with Black From Tula or maybe Paul Robeson or Cherokee Purple. Fusion

July 20, 2007	#14
amideutch Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Germany 49°26"N 07°36"E Posts: 5,041	Fusion, very interesting. Was this an intentional/unintentional cross. A little history please. Ami __________________ Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘...Holy Crap .....What a ride!'